Never thought I'd say this about Environmetal but...

[DSM16428]

Environmetal, the Makers of our beloved Hevi Metal goose STOMPING waterfowl loads is goin to put out a stacked, duplex load for turkey in get this...#4 Hevi Metal!!! Say whaaaaaaaat???!!! I fully under stand that steel will kill a turkey. I have done it, but to tout the new load (which is nothing more that a SLOWED DOWN duck load) as the next best turkey killer is beyond my comprehension. They are loaded as 3", 1 1/4 ounce #4s at 1450 fps and in 3.5", 1 1/2 ounce #4s at 1450 fs. that combo in and of itself would be about as perfect a duck destroyer load as I can imagine. Why on earth put steel in with Hevi Shot and call it a turkey load? Why not a stacked, duplex load of say lead and Hevi Shot?...makes a whole lot more sense doesn't it? Shaun, you gotta tell me this isn't gonna go through!!! I would hate to see Environmetal fall into the same silly marketing ploys that some of the other ammo makers are doing...Say it isn't so!

[tornadochaser]

haha..."call em in close".

I guess there might be a market for guys hunting turkeys on public land? Other than that, I see zero benefit to this load over lead or straight tungsten.

[DSM16428]

haha..."call em in close".

I guess there might be a market for guys hunting turkeys on public land? Other than that, I see zero benefit to this load over lead or straight tungsten.

When I hunt public game lands around here, I lug around the 835 stoked with 3.5" Mag Blends. No messin around when every idiot and their brother is out in the woods with you sqwuakin away on a box call.

[SPatrick]

Wow first I have seen of that....I will get some more info. I am guessing that this is going to reach into the lower price points. 2 words Magnum Blend .

[DSM16428]

Wow first I have seen of that....I will get some more info. I am guessing that this is going to reach into the lower price points. 2 words Magnum Blend .

I do LOVE me some Mag Blends!!

I'd just wait till Gander Mountain has it on clearance for 4 bucks a box...but wait!...then it'll be the same price as a box of 25 waterfowl loads.

Not touching this stuff with a 10 meter cattle prod...that's reserved for cashman anyways.

[SPatrick]

A buddy of mine is one of our top turkey guys at hevi, I am gonna drop him an email he will for sure have the scoop for us. It might not be until mid next week, I know his hunting schedule is crazy and I am heading out of town to hunt in just a bit. This kind of caught me off guard I usually get info like this weeks before it is put up on the site. If I had to guess, The price of this is what is going to make it a seller, but obviously I dont know any inside stuff about it yet lol.

[cashman]

I do LOVE me some Mag Blends!!

...

Not touching this stuff with a 10 meter cattle prod...that's reserved for cashman anyways.

huh huh... he said MMagnum... huh huh

...and you got to admit that 10meter cattle prod does do a heck of nice job on my hair in the mornings. AND it has the added benefit of making you feel all tingly inside fun fun!

[Minnesota GreyBrow]

I think it actually makes alot of sense for them as a company -- since they dont have lead products they are just trying to get as close cost wise to lead as they can and yet have a differentiated product:
1.of course it all depends on how well it kills
2. since everyone can only kill one turkey how much does the shell cost matter anyway? I dont think you shoot boxes of shells at turkeys like waterfowl.

If I were a turkey hunter I'd for sure just buy the pure heavy shot. My brother is the cheapest b*s*a*d I know and thats what he does.

[fisherhunter460]

One turkey a year is a bad estimate. I have the licenses to kill up to 6 turkeys this year. Personally the old copper plated lead is good enough for me. Shoot the birds in range and put the shot where it matters and you don't need the special stuff. I don't think this is a good ploy for Environmental. They make a good product for waterfowl. Why attempt to tarnish the praise?

[SPatrick]

I wouldn't say this is a ploy, the more I think about it I think it might be a pretty good idea. Hevi shot pretty much owns the top end market on Turkey ammo. But alot of guys dont want to spend $20+ a box on turkey ammo. If they can get this to those mid to low price ranges and still offer an excellent shell, the turkey market is theirs. Every turkey hunter knows that hevi 13 is the balls in the turkey world. Magnum blend is right there, but truly hasn't caught on just yet. With the die hard Turkey hunters and the competition shooters magnum blend is becoming the shell of choice. I am pretty sure the guys at Indian Creek chokes shoot magnum blend almost exclusively. The hevi metal turkey shell will be most likely be for the guys like myself who go a couple times a year. You should see me at these turkey shows I work, I look like an idiot lol. True fish out of water, I brought duck and goose calls to one last year, the turkey hunters didn't like it that much. They tried to get me to do a seminar last year at one, I told them I would talk about patterning a gun and that is it.

[tornadochaser]

I just don't see the point. What is the market for this load? Why shoot a tuned down duck load (1500 fps 3" 1 1/4 oz #4 duck load to a 1450 fps 1 1/4 oz #4) for turkeys? Are there so many guys hunting public lands that require steel shot for turkeys? Are there enough guys out there complaining about the price of tungsten turkey loads that an alternative was needed?
Even the marketing for this load implies that it is a short range load. If I'm calling a turkey in close like the ad says I should, I might as well shoot it with #7.5 lead through a .675 choke. More pellets on target, and energy retention won't be an issue. I don't see the price point for this load being cheaper than 10 rounds of buffered plated lead turkey loads either. Maybe I'm way off base and this stuff will produce softball sized patterns at 100 yards, but some how I don't see this taking off. I do foresee this load being pasted all over the hunting magazines though in the near future...

[DSM16428]

Guys have been murdering turkeys with 2 ounces of #4 lead from the muzzle to 50 yards for more years than I've been alive, let alone hunting. For that matter, my 1st bird last year fell stone dead at almost 40 with 1 1/4 ounces of Hevi from my 20 gauge. Steel shot in a turkey load?...eh, not in my guns. I have worked very hard on my turkey combos and with the right load, I can harvest a gobbler at 70 yards...THAT is my public land load. Where you have to compete with every knucklehead and his brother in the woods. I want...no I NEED the extra range that htl shot and even lead can give me over steel.

[wing seeker]

I agree that the Hevi 13 is as good of a turkey load as you can find.........

[loufaulkner]

I was told there are some places in east Tennessee that you can hunt turkey on that won't allow lead because of the waterfowl habitat, and I've hunted turkey on a WMA in Montgomery County, TN that is similar but doesn't have the restriction. I guess if I was to really consider it, I would try the HM turkey loads for those instances alone, but other than that, I'm sticking with Hevi 13 or Mag Blend. I'd have to see how it patterns through my turkey choke though, cause I might have to use my waterfowl choke instead. I agree, it would be an awesome waterfowl load.

[bulletman]

Two comments on this thread from me,

1) In Missouri there are some WMA's that require steel shot for doves and waterfowl and while I haven't checked probably turkey hunting too AND these turkey loads are legal for waterfowl too. Smart marketing?

2) I haven't shot much HD loaded shells but I wonder if patterns and effectiveness isn't better with steel than with HD and lead?

[DSM16428]

I was told there are some places in east Tennessee that you can hunt turkey on that won't allow lead because of the waterfowl habitat, and I've hunted turkey on a WMA in Montgomery County, TN that is similar but doesn't have the restriction. I guess if I was to really consider it, I would try the HM turkey loads for those instances alone, but other than that, I'm sticking with Hevi 13 or Mag Blend. I'd have to see how it patterns through my turkey choke though, cause I might have to use my waterfowl choke instead. I agree, it would be an awesome waterfowl load.

That's just it...it IS a waterfowl load...just with LESS pep. For what they will want for a 5 round box of these, you could get a 25 round box of the actuall waterfowl HM for less I promise. The fact that some WMAs don't allow lead is irrrelivant when you consider that hevi shot is lead free in the first place...no risk of lead in the ground/water to begin with.

[DSM16428]

Two comments on this thread from me,

1) In Missouri there are some WMA's that require steel shot for doves and waterfowl and while I haven't checked probably turkey hunting too AND these turkey loads are legal for waterfowl too. Smart marketing?

2) I haven't shot much HD loaded shells but I wonder if patterns and effectiveness isn't better with steel than with HD and lead?

Guys, ANY AND ALL HTL turkey loads are already approved for use on and in proximity to waterfowl to begin with. The fact that the shot is non-toxic in the HM turkey loads is again, irrelivant. As far as patterning. There is NO WAY that a large (#4) steel pellet is going to pattern as well as a load of smaller htl shot. Simply can't happen. Smart marketing?...don't think so.

[SPatrick]

Have you seen the price on these yet DSM?

[DSM16428]

Have you seen the price on these yet DSM?

Nope. Not yet. Kept my eyes open for any word on it since the adds came out though. Nothin so far from cabelas and they love to put new stuff in their catalogs before its available...

[dakotashooter2]

It's all about marketing. New product = new sales. As long as it sounds better people will buy it. I am amazed at the silly stuff people will buy and I've bought a few of them too. Most of the time if a person sticks to the basics they will do just fine.

I'm curious as to what kind of a shot string one gets in a duplex load when using shots similar in size but drastically different in weight. Especially at longer ranges.